The Liberated Bare and Dare—胆敢解放赤裸的超脱—Nicolas Guérin and Sheri Chiu

Paris.

Next to a little square above Parmentier, I walked into an absolutely bizarre setting: a “Kawaii” café filled with Japanese anime posters, PVC toys of cartoon characters, video games, Final Fantasy themed chairs and furiously uplifting opening songs of cartoon series’. Sitting in the “French-Otaku” run café, there is a feeling of an absurd contrast from the neighborhood around which is surrounded by old-school bars on the ground floor of 18th century Haussmann Parisian buildings with angry football fans. This is where I am to meet the well-known French portrait photographer Nicolas Guérin and his Chinese-American wife, Sheri Chiu. 

Sheri, twenty-three years old, has an adorable smile with minimalistic facial features, a school-girl looking bob cut that spells out innocence and a very soft and gentle voice that leaves the impression of a shy character. But she, a girl that does not look that much different than others her age, has been modeling nude since the age of eighteen, married a forty-year-old French photographer and moved to Paris for love, while working at one of the hippest fashion/art magazines as a journalist and creating unimaginable erotic photography with her husband.

Nicolas, walking next to Sheri, is almost as if looking into a mirror that shows one’s complete contradictory. He, in a pair of nonchalant jeans, represents “le French chic” on the end of artistic intellectuals. His careless beard with the occasional white hair sticking out of the picture speaks maturity and his pair of dark-colored eyes hide most of the deep thoughts and skepticism towards common society. The external juxtaposition between the married couple truly sticks out in a crowd. But once you get to know them, all the confusion and questions will be untied.

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Q: How did you two meet?

Sheri: I was born in New York, lived there for ten years and moved to Hong Kong where I lived for eight years. Later on, I moved back to New York to study journalism at NYU. I met Nicolas through Model Mayhem, which is a model profession website connecting freelance models and photographers.

Nicolas: Yes. We met and we flirted through the website for three weeks. It was clear that “things” were going to happen between us. So on New Year’s Eve, I flew to New York to fuck her. Therefore my primary purpose was not really to shoot her, although we did eventually, but only because we felt like we needed it as an excuse.

Sheri: We fell in love first, then we met, and then we shot together. The first photo shoot was just in the moment.

Q: What is the one strongest connection you found in each other?

Nicolas: I first stopped flirting with her a bit because she was nineteen and I was thirty-nine, and she was 6,000 kilometers away from me; there were a lot of reasons and it was not the easiest situation. But after meeting her, she was simply so spontaneous, odd and unstable; and I, on the contrary, was so sad and stable and boring. When we are together we can have a kind of balance so it was a really good match. I was unfortunately and completely trapped. But things weren’t easy since I just escaped a relationship myself and I had a family, a kid, my work, etc. Plus I did not expect myself to fall so deeply in love at the age of forty. I felt like I had a second chance to be happy with someone else.

Q: Did you ever think that you would end up with a guy like Nicolas?

Sheri: Before I dated guys mostly my own age, and I always fell for the wrong guy because I was really interested in bad guys who would treat me poorly.

Q: And why do you think that is?

Sheri: I was always drawn to the popular kids in school. I was obsessed with the leadership quality and I tried hard to fit in. Then I met Nicolas and he was stable, with a lot of love and nurturing to give. So I think this was what I needed.

Nicolas: This sounds better in words but not so much in reality.

Q: Why would such a progressive-minded couple like you two need to get married?

Nicolas: First of all it is the paper issues. I always fought to not get married. But it was necessary for her family, or even as a commitment to her since she was about to move from New York to Paris for me. My daughter and my whole family attended the ceremony in our studio/apartment. The wedding turned into an amazing “hippie” party after the family left. Everyone lost their minds and clothes and were dancing naked.

Q: Sheri, how did you start being a nude model?

Sheri: When I moved back to New York, I wanted to try out some school fashion shows and one of my friends suggested that I put some pictures on Model Mayhem. I started off with some boring and ugly commercial photo shoots, then one day I met a photographer, and my clothes came off.

“I think a lot of nude models do it to help them with their own self-confidence as well.”

Q: Was it natural when you got naked the first time in front of a camera?

Sheri: It was natural because it was new and exciting even though it was dangerous and, more importantly, against my educational background. I had my first nude shoot when I was eighteen and it truly opened up the gate of liberation for me. I think this behavior back then was a response to a need that I had at the time, eager to be acknowledged and recognized by society. I needed to feel like I existed. Realistically, it was a chain that led to this mentality. First I broke up with my college boyfriend. So this was a sort of game of seduction to validate myself that even after this break up, I was still beautiful, sexy and men still desired me. During each photo shoot, I would feel like there is a goal and I am often not very focused, so it became easier for me as time went by. And I think a lot of nude models do it to help them with their own self-confidence as well.

Nicolas: Plus that was the time when I realized that she is a true exhibitionist back then, haha. A few years ago we shot with the famous photographers Jim Goldberg, Martin Parr and Bruce Gilden in the streets. Sheri was naked in public with about one hundred people queuing to take pictures of her. She was so happy!

Sheri: It was fun!

Nicolas: She is less like that today but back then, she was not a nude model. She was a girl who needed to be naked in front of men to feel good.

Q: And how do you see the contradiction in yourself since you said you are interested in fashion and you work for a fashion magazine as a journalist, while on the other hand you pose naked, which is a bit “anti-fashion” as some might say?

Sheri: I am a fashion journalist but I like to analyze fashion from a distance, especially as a form of art. And I see nude modeling the same way as a form of art. So I do not see that fashion has to necessarily do with clothing. It can be an atmosphere, an attitude. It can be a lot of things.

Q: Do you, Nicolas, think you were influenced by Sheri and changed later on as well?

Nicolas: My life totally changed. I was much more conservative and bourgeois. When we first met, she was very neurotic about meeting photographers and shooting nude. But at least she dared something, even though it was forbidden and dangerous for her. Me, I was not so brave. I was a very well known photographer for portraiture, and a director, so it was hard for me to get out of my comfort zone and do erotic photography. I was shooting very academic nudes with no sexual meaning at the time. And it was because I was in love, and proud to be in love with her, I moved passed the barriers in my heart and started shooting things with more of a sexual atmosphere.

“Everybody understands my portraits, but it is not as easy to get people to understand eroticism.”

Nicolas: The first erotic series I shot was a long series of around thirty different people making love and girls having orgasms, which I published in my book. The inspiration of this project was from last spring, when we knew that we would not meet for three months and I would be all-alone. It was a difficult time and I was really missing her orgasms and other sexual joy. So I decided to start shooting other girls having orgasms. It was not easy to be understood at first, even for Sheri, but it was meaningful for me. For many years, a few girls offered me this opportunity to do a masturbation shoot and I always rejected it even though I always loved eroticism in literature, painting and cinema; but it is another step to decide you would shoot yourself erotically because you either have to be very, very naïve or very self confident to be able to do so. Plus, we already have a lot of amazing people doing erotic photography such as Ren Hang or Nobuyoshi Araki. In the meantime, I started these ideas because I needed a balance when Sheri was looking for photographers to shoot her naked and I needed to play the other role. Still it was not as easy for a serious portrait photographer to shoot eroticism. Everybody understands my portraits, but it is not as easy to get people to understand eroticism.

 

After Sheri crawled into this exciting yet mature marriage, they started working together to shoot erotic photography. Their souls grinding and resonating create sparkles that surprise, amaze and confuse the world. Sheri, who looks shy and innocent but is indeed riotous, bold and unrestrained; in combination with Nicolas, who looks dissipated but was, in fact, once reserved and restrained; both using their uncommon love and understanding explore and discover new levels and definitions of the human sexual and emotional world.

“We do not really have this idea of what is appropriate and what is not in our relationship.”

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Nicolas: So yes, I have definitely changed due to the strong influence of Sheri. Before, I was too conscious about the limit of what is appropriate and what is not, which is a very stupid and bourgeois behavior. Sheri, on the other hand, was totally ‘inappropriate’; she was always naked, even in front of kids and families in public. So we do not really have this idea of what is appropriate and what is not in our relationship.

Q: How do both of your families react to the fact that you are shooting nude and sometimes eroticism together?

Nicolas: My family, after being on set once and seeing how beautiful Sheri can be when she is naked and how amazing the pictures turned out, totally changed their ideas and are now very supportive and comfortable with us doing this. And they know a lot about my work now ever since.

Sheri: My family is the complete opposite.

Q: (Jokingly) Do they even know you are married?

Sheri: Yes, of course.

Nicolas: Unfortunately, haha.

Sheri: My parents had a very different education and they are much more close-minded and are both quite traditionally Chinese, even though my dad is quite Americanized since he moved to the U.S. at one-year-old and my mum moved there when she was sixteen. Despite their conservative ideas, they see that I am very happy with Nicolas so they try to understand.

Q: What was the biggest problem or concern for them to accept Nicolas?

Nicolas: The ethnic differences perhaps. And I think this is a BIG problem. If I were a forty-year-old Chinese photographer, this would cause way less trouble. And also the fact that I had already another family is a big matter.

Sheri: Actually I think age and profession were more of the questions. They do not understand photography since they have no culture in art. They came to America to survive, to make a business, to feed their family and to live the American dream. So that created a distance as well.

Nicolas: As you see Sheri’s name means “darling” in French (Chérie), she was a nude model and she has the same birthday as my daughter, but not the same year at least. So when you meet a girl like this, you have to marry her, haha.

Q: Are you still doing portrait photography or are you focusing more on erotic photography?

Nicolas: Yes, I have to because that is still my main job. I was lucky when I was studying to have had the opportunities to shoot famous people such as Quentin Tarantino six times, Woody Allen five times, Martin Scorsese six times and David Lynch five times, etc. Even Chinese movie legends such as Zhang Yimou (张艺谋), Gong Li (巩俐), Zhang Ziyi (章子怡) and many more. So today I love doing portraits of people from cinema more than anything because I am absolutely fascinated by these people. Last year I shot with Meryl Streep in Berlin, and after the shooting I cried for five minutes. It was so emotional for me because you see them in the movies and they represent so much for me. So I will for sure continue with portrait photography. But I cannot continue this all my life, so eventually I will need to move to some other type of photography.

What is really interesting in our process of liberation; of course, as a couple, we would have limitations of freedom and it is not always easy for her to understand me shooting a naked girl – she would feel a bit attacked and insecure about it, and the same for me to accept her taking photos with other photographers. Therefore, the most recent thing we have done together is started to shoot other nude models with Sheri and I together as the photographer. Since Sheri has no knowledge with light, angles and positions, she just needs to direct the girl to shoot what she wants and sees in her mind, and I take care of the technical part. This is very interesting since Sheri is a nude model and she is directing another nude model, and on top of that it is unusual for a woman to shoot another woman erotically. This creates an exciting point of view.

Sheri: For me it is really about the attitude and emotions. But I think Nicolas and I share a common view on erotic photography, so it is really efficient when one person is behind the camera and the other directs and guides the model. Nicolas brings his expertise and experience with his knowledge; with me it is more experimental, naïve and fun. I think girls can give me a different attitude and reactions as opposed to Nicolas. I think it depends on the girl since some girls are very comfortable and offer me more, while others might actually enjoy the process of seducing a male photographer or maybe they feel more excited in front of a guy.

Nicolas: But in fact some girls have told us that they would not feel as comfortable and free if they were alone with me. Since Sheri is on set, they feel more secured, more relaxed and confident. Before I did photo shoots that express the intimacy and the melting of two bodies in a blurry and unspecific way. But this time we both want it to be sharper and more direct about erotica. So it is not guaranteed that girls can easily masturbate in front of me at three o’clock in the morning but if we appear as a married couple with Sheri who is also a nude model, interesting and more direct images are almost promised to come out.

Q: How do you find your models?

Nicolas: They are mostly friends, or friends through the internet. Mostly it was the magic of the shoot, since we shoot very privately in our studio late at night. For me this is absolutely the most beautiful thing we could shoot.

Sheri: Plus, when Nicolas gives an idea, I can feed off that inspiration and go off in another direction, to really try to get everything from the pose. I push the limit of his point of view even further.

Nicolas: Sometimes, I would stop the shooting, since my subconscious and photography instincts cannot approve what Sheri might do. But she would insist on trying and sometimes, even though it does look odd and strange, it actually creates a new level and a new vision of beauty.

Now, there is a new question we have asked ourselves about couples, nudes and photography: what about me shooting Sheri with another girl or another guy? Or even Sheri shooting me included in the photos.

Q: So what is the boundary or limitation to your erotic photography between the two of you?

Nicolas: For me, I do not want to take photos just for my own excitement, and I want the photo to still have a meaning and values when I see it; or an emotion that I can share with others exists in it. So one can find common emotions in the orgasm series I did before.

The big difference between Sheri and me is that almost every time she is excited and aroused during the shoot while I am never. In a way, I would love to experience this feeling. The only time this happened was the very first nude shoot of my life with a girl who was nineteen years old. After that, whenever I am working, I am completely out of my body and never excited about the sexy scenes in front of me. The camera actually puts me at a distance, terribly. I would love to be more intimate and spontaneous, and less cold with my emotions when shooting.

Sheri: Because I started nude modeling for self-validation so photo shoots meant sex to me. I would always get super excited and I didn’t really care about the photos, it was more about the experience and chemistry that came with it. Which is something the Nicolas has not really experienced. For me, I would like Nicolas to feel it just to see how it feels.

Nicolas: Really? Are you sure?

Sheri: Yeah! But recently this has changed. For example, the last time I went for an erotic photo shoot, I could not feel anything sexual and exciting. The chemistry seems to have run away.

Nicolas: And frankly, seeing other people loving and having sex together makes me cry. I am always touched by the combination of two human souls. So next week I am going to step out of this phase and shoot with a girl that I am excited about and afterwards, Sheri has to be happy about it, haha.

Q: Do you get judgment or disapproval from friends, family or the society?

Sheri: For a long time I kept modeling a secret from my friends and family. A lot of my male friends don’t understand actually and what confuses them more is that Nicolas is comfortable with me posing nude. I find my female friends more open about it. And my parents are still critical. Overall, I do find that society criticizes what I do since it is not in line with the society that (believes) one should be clothed and behave.

Q: Do you attempt to convey any sort of message or meaning with your naked body? Or does it simply make you happy?

Sheri: It really does make me happy. And I just love experimenting and creating new images, exploring ideas and concepts with Nicolas. It is an overall life experience.

Q: How do you separate erotic art from pornography?

Nicolas: It is very simple. Pornography is images that excite people sexually. But you cannot masturbate to the images of the girls having orgasms that I shot. There are no dicks, no pussies – but love, emotions and melting bodies.

But there might still be exceptions with blurred lines. For example, the pictures of Araki – even though they are very beautiful and artistic, with a little bit of imagination, I can still masturbate to them. It is still Japanese girls opening their legs.

Q: Do you think working together makes you two more in love?

Nicolas, Sheri: Yes.

Nicolas: A perfect example is that last week when we were in Barcelona, the entrance of the building we stayed at was gorgeous. So at four o’clock in the morning, I told Sheri to take off her clothes and we simply starting shooting gorgeous images with my iPhone. It is great to have someone who always gives you inspiration and is always available – I do not want to use the word “muse” because it is so cliché. And to me, the shoots with Sheri are always the most important ones, even though she does not understand it sometimes. It is easy to shoot a beautiful girl of nineteen years old, but what is difficult is to make the beauty last.

 

胆敢解放赤裸的超脱——对话拆除文化和社会隔阂的Nicolas GuérinSheri Chiu

巴黎。

在离Parmentier不远处的一个小广场旁,我犹豫地走进一个诡异的场景。这是一家墙壁贴满了五彩斑斓的漫画海报,摆满模型手办,电子游戏和最终幻想主题的桌椅,大声放着激动到不合常理的动漫开场主题曲的“kawaii”咖啡厅。我推开一把椅子,坐在几个法国“宅男”面前,感受着这与周围环境毫不沾边,仿佛踏入纳尼亚一般的不解。这个被一圈18世纪奥斯曼世的建筑下闹哄哄的在酒吧喝酒的球迷围绕着的咖啡厅,就是著名法国人像摄影师Nicolas Guérin和美籍华人兼自称“暴露狂”的Sheri Chiu,这对绝对够奇葩的夫妇,约我访谈的地方。 

Sheri,一个23岁的华裔女孩,带有东方简约美的脸上总是挂着一个天真烂漫的含羞笑意,梳着乖乖女的Bob头,讲话的时候温文儒雅。从表面上看,她和同龄人几乎没有什么差别。但也就是她,自18岁开始了她当裸模的生涯。嫁给了一个40岁的已婚法国摄影师之后,为爱远走巴黎。而同时她给时下最潮的时装艺术杂志之一写稿,并且还在和丈夫合作拍摄各种情色摄影艺术。够酷了吧?

Nicolas,走在Sheri的旁边,几乎就像一面能找出一个人完完全全相反特征的镜子。穿着法式轻雅随性的牛仔裤,走路时透漏着一副新派艺术家的风范。他不经打理的胡渣,几根若隐若现的白色毛发,一对似乎隐藏了对频繁社会充满怀疑的深邃的暗色双眸,都散发着浓烈的成熟和性感的味道。这一对外在天差地别的夫妇极其容易的就能从人群中跳出来,而只有在和他们真正深入对话之后,才能解开这一切的疑惑。

Q :你们是如何相遇的?

Sheri 我出生长大于纽约和香港,之后我在纽约大学上的新闻系。而我们相遇是通过Model Mayhem这个连接自由职业的模特和摄影师的网站。

Nicolas是的。我们先是在网上暧昧调情了三个星期,一切都很显然会发生。于是我干脆在跨年之夜飞到纽约去上她。所以当初我就没有想要真的拍她的意思。但是最后还是为了给自己一个借口勉强拍了一组。

Sheri我们是先相爱,再相遇。他第一次拍我只是因为当下时机的需要。

Q :你们在对方身上找到最能互相连接住的特质是什么?

Nicolas刚接触她的时候,我试图想停止这种关系。不仅因为她当时才19而我当时39岁,她还住在离我6000公里之外的纽约。种种因素都告诉我这不是一个理智的决定。但是认识他之后,我发现Sheri是一个及其突发,随机,奇特和不稳定的女孩子。而我则是一个忧伤,无聊又稳定的老男人。但是当我们在一起时,两个人的性格很完美的相互平衡和补足了。于是我很不幸的完全陷入了爱河。但是介于我那时刚离婚,还拖着一个家庭,一个孩子,事实还是不大允许。而且我从未想过在自己40岁之年还能为一个女子如此疯狂,就像是人生给了我第二次爱的机会一般难以置信。

Q :(问Sheri)你以前有想过最后会和Nicolas这样的人在一起吗?

Sheri:以前我大部分都和同龄男生交往,而且我特别偏好坏男孩。于是常常受到伤害。

Q:为什么你会专门喜欢坏男孩呢?

Sheri :我一向都很崇拜那些受欢迎的同学。我对领袖精神几近着迷并且我很想被认同。但是当我遇到Nicolas的时候,我非常有安全感,非常的自信、自在。

Nicolas她这么一解释听起来比真正的现实好听多了哈哈。

Q:为什么向你们想法这么超前的情侣会想到要结婚?

Nicolas :第一,我们存在身份文件上的问题。我一直是抗拒婚姻的而我真心不需要。但是这件事对于她的父母很重要,并且也算是我对她衷心的一个诺言,毕竟她已经为了我搬来巴黎。我全家人包括女儿都参加了在我们工作室兼公寓里举办的婚礼。家属一走,就马上变成了十足“嬉皮趴体”。到最后所有奖金60个朋友都疯狂的宽衣解带,全裸热舞。

Q:你是怎么开始做裸模的,Sheri?

Sheri: 当我搬回纽约上大学的时候,我很想要尝试一下学校的时装秀和挡一下模特。于是我朋友建议我把照片传到Model Mayhem这个网站上。刚开始的时候我拍了一堆又丑又没意思的商业化的照片。有一天我遇到了一个摄影师,然后不知不觉的,我的衣服就一件一件脱了下来。

“我觉得很多裸模之所以会上瘾,都是因为她们缺乏自信。”

Q:你第一次在镜头面前全裸的时候有什么奇怪或不自然的感觉吗?

Sheri由于那是一个对我来说虽然有点危险和与我的教育背景相冲突的事,但同时也很新鲜,很刺激。所以我其实并不紧张。第一次拍摄的时候我才18岁,这也是开启我人生自我解放的大门的一个重要事件。我觉得当时之所以会想做这件事是因为我迫切需要被肯定,被认同的一种渴望。我需要感受自己存在的意义。现实点说,我当时刚和大学时期的男朋友分手,于是当裸体模特几乎类似于一种用来证明自己还是美的,性感的和被男人渴望的挑逗性游戏。每次拍照的时候,我都会内心存在着一个目标,并且比较涣散,于是就都进展的很顺利。所以我觉得很多裸模之所以会拍上瘾,都是因为她们缺乏自信。

Nicolas:况且那也是我发现其实Sheri是个“暴露狂”的时候。几年前,我们和Jim Goldberg、Martin Parr和Bruce Gilden三位世界知名的摄影师合作。Sheri就直接在街头宽衣解带,引来现场一百多人围观拍照。她自己享受的很!

Sheri:太好玩了那一次!

Nicolas:她那时候与其说是一个裸体模特,不如说她是个需要在男人面前裸体才能开心的女孩儿。

Q: Sheri你自己本身是时尚写手,但同时也是个天体爱好者。这两者之间不会产生冲突吗?总是拍裸体摄影的你,算不算带点“逆-时尚”的讽刺味道?

Sheri:我虽然是时尚写手,但是我喜欢从一个距离,尤其是以一种艺术形态去分析和看待时装。而我看待裸体也是一样的观点。所以我不认为时尚一定要有实体的衣物。它可以是一个氛围,一种态度,或者很多其他的东西。

Q : Nicolas,你认为自己有因为Sheri而改变吗?

Nicolas我的人生发生了天翻地覆的变化。从前的我更保守,更乏味。当我们刚认识的时候,她近乎神经质一般地不停和摄影师拍裸体照。但是至少我认为她敢于去做一件有风险的,被禁忌的事情。相反,我做不到。我一贯都是以人像摄影和导演出名,所以要让我甩开自己的束缚去拍情色摄影是一件非常挑战的事。刚开始的时候,我拍的都是带着弄弄学术味的,没有太多性暗示的裸体摄影。但是正是由于我奋不顾身地爱上了她,并且为此感到自豪,我才迈出了那一步并开始拍摄真正的情色艺术摄影。

“几乎每一个人都能看懂我的人像,但是要让他们理解色情艺术丝毫不简单。”

Nicolas:我拍摄的第一组情色系列中,一共拍了三十个人上床。而我重点拍的是女性高潮之前的那一刻,并发表在了我的书中。我的灵感来源是因为上一个春天,我和Sheri分隔两地三个月之久。于是每天孤零零的我,开始想念她的性喜悦和性高潮。于是我决定开始用我的相机捕捉其他女性的性高潮。多年以来,很多女孩子都问过我能不能拍她们自慰的照片,但我都一一回绝了。尽管我热爱存在于文学,绘画和电影中的情色艺术,但是真正要自己着手去感受和拍摄的话,我要么得很自信,要么得很天真。再说了,如今拍摄色情艺术的摄影师也数不胜数。比如说任航,或者知名的日本摄影师Nobuyoshi Araki等等。同时,我之所以会开始拍摄还因为Sheri在纽约的时候仍在不停地寻觅摄影师为她拍摄裸照,而我迫切地需要寻找一种心理平衡。但是我的这一系列鲜有人知,因为几乎每一个人都能看懂我拍的人像,但是要让他们理解色情艺术丝毫不简单。

当Sheri来到巴黎,爬入这一场刺激又沉稳的婚姻时,他们开始共同合作拍摄情色摄影。他们灵魂的互相共鸣,碰撞出了让世俗惊讶并且不解的火花。外表看似保守但内心奔放不羁的Sheri,和外表看似浪荡但内心一度守旧的Nicolas,用互相不寻常的爱和理解,不断地在摸索人类感情和性爱生活的新境界、新领域。

 

“我们的感情中,并不存在一个准确、鲜明的道德底线。”

Nicolas:所以很直白的,我受Sheri的影响改变了许多。从前,我对于事物的对错,好坏和道德的标准都太在意,太敏感了。这是非常愚蠢的资产阶级的思想。但是Sheri是一个行为非常“不当”和“不检点”的人。她几乎永远是裸体的,甚至在小孩和家庭面前也毫不在意。所以她深深地从灵魂深处改变了我。所以我们的感情中,并不存在一个准确、鲜明的道德底线。

Q: 你们双方的家人是怎么看待你们拍摄的情色艺术?

Nicolas:我的家人一次在现场看我们的拍摄,他们看到Sheri裸体时窒息般的美,他们感受到了那种艺术的灵动。于是他们彻底地改变了观念,并且如今对此非常的支持和理解。

Sheri:我的家人是恰恰相反。

Q: 他们知道你结婚了吧?(开玩笑)

Sheri:当然当然。

Nicolas:当然是很不幸的,哈哈。

Sheri:我的家人,虽然在美国长大,但他们仍旧抱着许多传统的观念。但是即便如此,他们眼看着我和Nicolas一起过的很快乐,也在慢慢尝试理解着。

Q: 你的家长最不能接受Nicolas什么?

Nicolas:也许是我们的种族差别。如果今天我是一个40岁的中国摄影师,这一切都不会这么复杂。而且可能也不能接受我和前妻的家庭。

Sheri:老实说,我认为年龄和职业问题比较大。我父母并不理解摄影艺术而且他们也没有艺术底蕴。他们去到美国是为了生存,养家糊口,创业致富,为了美国梦而奋斗的。所以这让我们产生了距离。

Nicolas:你要想,当你遇到一个女孩儿,名字在法语里面是“甜心” 的意思,(因为Sheri在法语里音同Chérie(甜心,宝贝)), 还是个漂亮的裸体模特,甚至连她的生日都跟我女儿一样!(至少不是同年哈哈)这样的姑娘,你能不娶吗?

 

Q : 你还在坚持拍摄人像摄影吗?还是你希望从今专攻情色艺术摄影?

Nicolas我会坚持的,毕竟这是我的本行。从我30岁开始,我很幸运的得到了六次拍Tarantino,五次拍Woody Allen,六次拍Martin Scorsese和五次拍David Lynch等等世界级大导演和演员的机会。甚至是中国的殿堂级导演和演员,例如张艺谋,巩俐,章子怡等等。所以时至今日我仍旧热爱着人像摄影,因为对于我来说,没有什么比拍摄电影行业中的传奇更加让我激动和兴奋的事了。去年我在柏林拍了Meryl Streep,在拍摄完以后,我足足哭了有五分钟。我经常很情绪化,很容易被这些经历所触动。所以我一定会继续走这条路,但我也不能一辈子只做这一件事。

而谈到我们正处于自我解放过程当中的情色摄影,很显然的,作为夫妇的我们俩,存在着一定程度的自由和理解能力的限制。有时我在拍摄火辣的女孩自慰时,Sheri也会没有安全感或有威胁感。同样的,当她在和别的好色的摄影师拍裸照时,我也并不舒心。于是,近期我们夫妻档同时作为摄影师,开始联手一起拍摄裸体艺术。由于Sheri并不了解摄影技术层面的许多知识,她只负责引导模特摆出她脑海中所想要的画面。由于这是Sheri这一个23岁的做过裸模的女孩的创意和概念,自然和我所想很多东西的截然不同。并且似乎很少有女性拍摄其他女性的情色艺术照。所以这一视角是新鲜的,刺激的。

Sheri对于我来说最重要的是态度和情感。但是我觉得Nicolas和我对情色艺术的看法很接近,所以我们合作起来效率很高。Nicolas在相机后用专业知识来协助我,而对于我来说这是件很实验性,很天真,无知,又很有趣的事情。我认为作为女性,我的很多观点和想法和Nicolas是相反的。然而有时候模特会更信任我,有时候则会更享受和男摄影师调情的感觉。

Nicolas但事实上有些女孩跟我们说,如果不是Sheri也在场的话,她们不会如此放松和有安全感。由于我们是以夫妻的身份去拍摄,并且我们这一次想要拍更直接,尖锐,原始的照片,所以Sheri的出现让很多人更能将自己一览无遗地展现在镜头面前。

Q :你们是如何找到这些裸模的?

Nicolas:她们大部分都是朋友,有少数是网络上认识的。然后就是我们这个拍摄的奇妙特质在吸引着人们。凌晨三点的昏暗灯光,在我们自己的工作室中,对我来说这是我们可以拍摄的最美的事物。

Sheri:而且当Nicolas给我一个灵感时,我可以将它继续延伸,探索这个灵感的极限。

Nicolas:有时候,我会在某个地方停下拍摄。因为我的潜意识和摄影直觉告诉我这样下去不会好看。但是Sheri总会坚持一下,并且常常出来的效果虽然不按我的常理出牌,但是奇特得非常美。

现在我们有一个新的挑战。那就是拍摄Sheri和另一个她有好感的男人上床,或者她拍摄我。

:你们两人之间拍摄情色摄影的底线是什么?

Nicolas对我来说,我不想要纯粹为了自我的欢愉而拍照,我还是希望我的照片能被赋予一个含义,价值或者情感。所以在我之前拍摄的“高潮”系列中,你是可以发现一个情感规律的。

而Sheri和我最大的不同之处在于她总是能被周围的环境或者拍摄的对象挑起欲火。从某种程度上说,我很希望能体验这一种感觉。我唯一一次有过生理反应的拍摄是我第一次尝试拍一个裸女。她19岁的曼妙身姿让我立马激动了起来。但从那以后,我每次拍摄时都想魂魄出窍了一般。我认为相机在我和情欲之间保护着我,让我保持一段距离。但事实上我很希望能够真正体会那种自发的,亲密的情感传递,而不是像我现在一般冷漠。

Sheri:鉴于我开始当裸模的时候是为了寻找自我认同感,所以当时拍照对我来说就等于上床。我的欲望总是很容易就能被勾起,而且老实说我并不在乎拍出来的成果。而更重要的,是那个过程和那种微妙的化学反应。其实我是希望Nicolas也能体会到着一种感觉的。

Nicolas:真的吗?你确定?

Sheri:是啊!但是近期我觉得自己变了。比如我上一次拍色情艺术照的时候,我完全感受不到任何激情。也许那种感受已经不复存在了。

Nicolas: 老实说,看到他人在真情流露的做爱时,我是会流泪的。我会被他们那种亲密,那种热烈,那种两个灵魂的曼妙结合所感动。所以最近我会去寻找一个我也为之心动的女孩,和她拍完以后,Sheri还不能生气哦!哈哈。

Q :你们做的事会遭到身边朋友或来自社会的不解和反对吗?

Sheri:我做裸模的很长一段时间里我都没有和任何人说过。我很多男性朋友都对我做这件事非常不解,并且更让他们疑惑的是Nicolas居然没有意见并且很支持。相比之下我觉得我的女性朋友都比较支持我。我的家长当然是不赞同的。总体来说,由于我做的事情偏离了社会给我们设好的路,我又不穿衣服又不规规矩矩,所以难免会招来言论。

Q :你有试图想用自己赤裸的身体表达一些什么信息或理念吗?还是它只是单纯的让你开心?

Sheri:这真的让我非常开心。并且我很钟情于和Nicolas一起试验和创造新的图像,探索新的主意和概念。这是一个宏观的人生体验。

Q你们是如何区分色情片和色情艺术的?

Nicolas:这很简单。色情片是为了让一个人有生理反应的影像。而你并不能对着色情艺术自慰。比如说我的“高潮”系列里,没有阴茎,没有阴道,只有模糊的情感和融合似水般的身体形态。

但是这之中也有例外。比如说日本色情艺术家Araki的很多照片,只要多加一点想象,我也可以对着他们手淫。毕竟怎么说还是张开大腿的漂亮日本女孩儿嘛哈哈。

Q :你们认为一起合作会让你们更加相爱吗?

SheriNicolas:是的。

Nicolas:一个最好的例子就是我们上周一起在巴塞罗那时一个醉醺醺的夜晚。我们踉踉跄跄回到家门口,突然意识到那楼梯间的工业美。于是Sheri瞬间脱了衣服,在凌晨四点的时分,我就举着我的iphone在拍照。能够在每时每刻有一个(我不想叫缪斯,因为我觉得太俗气了)能给你灵感的人并且一直陪伴在你身边是一件难能可贵的事情。而且和Sheri拍的每一次照片都是我最重要的拍摄。但是她经常不理解这一点。要拍一个美丽的年轻女孩很容易,但是要让这一切停留在永恒,那才是挑战。

Article by Bohan Qiu

Published on the “NAKED” issue of Elsewhere Magazine 

 

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